Comments on: Philly’s Beer Police State

By: Beer Radar » Blog Archive » Memphis Taproom/Local 44/Resurrection Raid, cont'd

Tue, 09 Mar 2010 11:28:25 +0000

[...] bloggers have noticed, including Jay Brooks out in Californy. Here’s the chatter at the Brew Lounge, FooBooz, Philly Speaks/West Philly & /Food [...]

By: Martyn Cornell

Martyn Cornell — Tue, 09 Mar 2010 00:12:19 +0000

Andy, only a lawyer could argue your points. The law is stupid and unjustified. Stupid and unjustified laws should be defied, not defended with the flabby response “well, it is the law, you know.”

By: Mr. Nuts

Mr. Nuts — Mon, 08 Mar 2010 21:18:02 +0000

Maybe the PLCB can have a page on a web site somewhere listing the approved beers — using bar codes to identify them.

That way, the police or whoever could just enter in a short string of numbers instead of some name that might be shortened, etc.

Of course, most kegs aren’t bar coded for retail sale — but since you can buy a permanent bar code for something like $10 and print up a label on a computer — it shouldn’t be a big deal for breweries to comply.

By: Chris Howard

Chris Howard — Mon, 08 Mar 2010 19:15:07 +0000

easong, don’t get too happy about California as they contemplate going after coffee stouts (not to mention infusions). http://www.examiner.com/examiner/x-241-Beer-Examiner~y2010m3d2-Coffee-ales-and-lagers-threatened-in-California

By: Eric

Eric — Mon, 08 Mar 2010 18:28:33 +0000

Well, maybe not strictly speaking a Sixth amendment violation by the police (you sure it’s not criminal?), but very probably a Fourth Amendment violation (“unreasonable siezure”; especially because it sounds like their paperwork didn’t properly identify beers) and/or Fifth (“deprived of [...] property, without due process of law”); especially since it sounds like the beer will effectively be destroyed (rendered less tasty) regardless of whether or not the beer or bar is in violation of the law.

By: easong

easong — Mon, 08 Mar 2010 18:27:18 +0000

Yet another reason to never move out of California to some primitive backwards state. I love dropping into the Bistro, for example, to see what rare keg the proprietor has fetched in the back of his truck from some exotic brewery for his appreciative patrons.

By: J

Mon, 08 Mar 2010 18:17:11 +0000

Yeah, I get what you mean. I initially reacted viscerally not so much because of the underlying law, but because of the methods employed.

By: Andy Crouch

Andy Crouch — Mon, 08 Mar 2010 18:05:21 +0000

Hey Jay-

Not to be intentionally contrarian, but I’m having trouble getting too worked up over this whole PLCB/cop raid situation. At least one of these bar owners acknowledges having run afoul of the law by procuring a keg from outside the state and driving back to their bar and putting it on tap. Putting aside the issues of whether brand registration is a meaningful regulation and who share bear the financial burden for offering/selling products that are not registered, these bar owners likely know that several of these brands, especially the one-offs, are not registered in the state and that they are therefore violating the law in selling them. There is certainly an argument that the theatrical nature of the raids, from the undoubtedly one-sided reports we’ve been hearing, was over the top and that governmental (and certainly police) priorities could likely be better placed elsewhere. And there is room for criticism where the police confiscated beers whose names are somehow slightly altered from that found on the state’s lists. But these bar owners know how heavily the beverage alcohol business is regulated and they well know the rules in Pennsylvania and they’ve cleared flouted them on occasion. Someone, somewhere along the way, could very easily have noticed that a beer such as Pliny the Younger does not appear on the state’s list. Be it the distributor or the bar owner, rules are rules, stupid or not.

As to your Sixth Amendment point, the right of confrontation only applies in criminal proceedings, a point these raids have not yet (and hopefully will not) reached. The PLCB and cops are certainly within their authority to protect the identity of the informant/tattle-tale/competitor/actually concerned citizen.