Comments on: Top Ten Tuesday: Top 10 Least Favorite Defects

By: Spencer

Spencer — Thu, 26 Feb 2009 22:26:49 +0000

I used to hate sulfur. Then a local brewpub started making lagers that were sulfury when fresh. At first, I’d go in, and the brewer would say “Spencer, you want to wait a couple of weeks before trying the Pilsner” (or whatever beer was freshly brewed.) But, eventually I came to appreciate it, and now find a hint of sulfur (burnt match or SO2, not rotten egg, which is H2S) adds interest to the beer’s aroma.

My bugaboo is acetaldehyde. I’ll send back a beer with high acetaldehyde, and will suffer through one that is otherwise good if it has low, but detectable acetaldehyde. I just can’t stand the stuff.

By: michael Reinhardt

michael Reinhardt — Thu, 26 Feb 2009 20:48:59 +0000

I agree that many of these are terrible defects. It is ironic that in Lager making that some brewers hate sulphur or skunk and others essentially require it to be above a certain threshold. It certainly can be a sign of bacterial contamination but not exclusively. I know I was a little concerned when I brewed a Lager and I could smell Sulphur (Lager yeasts being notorious for producing sulphur compounds) through the airlock. It subsided after the yeast cleaned it back up. So, the sulphur could be a sign of a lack of maturation. And you can’t discount that some people are aiming for that, but I’ve never seen it simply as iron clad proof that bacterial contamination has occurred. Of course, these thought are not simple my own. Bamforth expatiates on this in his book “Tapping into the Science and Art of Hombrewing.” I guess, everything in its right place. If I get a beer that isn’t a lager that has these qualities I’m sending or taking it back. With Lagers I’m a little more understanding. After all, the brewer might be going for a little sulphur. I drank Sierra Nevada Pale Ale not too long ago and it had skunked. I didn’t exactly hate it but it was certainly out of place. I agree about the quick remedy being to put beer in brown bottles to avoid light striking. Those same breweries can use inhibitors to resist light striking.

I can say that I really hate when fruit is added to beer. I’m not talking a Lambic or a something that was put in there during wort cooking or fermenting. I’m thinking specifically of beers that add fruit juice after fermentation has completed. Examples that I’m talking about include Leinenkugel’s Berry Weisse and Blue Dog. They are way out of balance and cloying. Along the same lines, I wrote an article about putting Citrus in beers (especially wheat beer). Absolutely hate it when people do this De Facto.
http://thankheavenforbeer.com/2009/01/08/why-did-you-have-to-put-a-lemon-in-it/

By: Lew Bryson

Lew Bryson — Thu, 26 Feb 2009 20:09:59 +0000

You got a high D threshold too? Wonder if we really DO have a high threshold, or it’s just that everybody else is too damned whiney about it…

By: J

Thu, 26 Feb 2009 18:25:37 +0000

Bueller, no worries. You’re right – in small amounts in can work well. The smell produced by a lit match can be quite pleasant I’ve found, an egg gone bad, not so much.

By: Marie D

Marie D — Thu, 26 Feb 2009 16:57:07 +0000

I second Mitch on the “soy sauce” comment. For whatever reason I feel that particular flavor has been popping up more and more, and it does not appeal to me.

By: Stephen Beaumont

Stephen Beaumont — Thu, 26 Feb 2009 13:42:12 +0000

Call me Bueller, Jay, but sometimes a little sulfur can be a wonderful thing. Drinking cask Bass or Pedigree in Burton-on-Trent — back when the former was still brewed there — was an experience in sulfur appreciation. Even when it’s fresh in the bottle, Pedigree can have a most enjoyable and appetizing note of “lit match.”

By: Nathan Smith

Nathan Smith — Thu, 26 Feb 2009 04:00:44 +0000

Forgetting for a moment about the ones don’t belong at all…
- Sharp, harsh, phenolics from wild yeast. Not the nice spicy ones you might get from WLP550. Or, phenolics at all in a style that doesn’t call for them. Smoky phenolics almost always.
- Diesel fuel/burnt electric wire quality of aggressively hopped beers from hops with a high myrcene content (such as Amarillo). This one plays badly with even moderate ester character. Imagine drinking a beer & huffing diesel exhaust from 880/101,etc.
- Detectable levels of Diacetyl and an aggressive American citrus hop character. The flavors can clash very quickly. This problem becomes even more amplified if there are already significant quantities of big crystal malt present: butterscotch. Low to moderate levels of diacetyl in a nice low hopped Scotttish style Ale or a low hopped stout can add some nice flavor and mouthfeel though.
- Young brett/lacto/pedio beer: Enteric, smoky, cigar-like flavors destroys anything else that might be going on.

By: Mitch

Mitch — Wed, 25 Feb 2009 23:21:42 +0000

Acetaldhyde is the one I can’t stand. Excessive pumpkin seed aroma and flavor (some call it green apple seed)ruins a beer for me.

Don’t much like soy sauce flavor in oxidized dark beers either.

I can handle D in small doses, but if it’s a serious brewing technical defect, then I’ll send the beer back. But in a Fullers ESB, no problem!

Graininess/oxidation I like in bigger beers when it blends in with other flavors and softens the alcohol.

By: John E Fresh

John E Fresh — Wed, 25 Feb 2009 18:53:19 +0000

“Catty (when it’s bad cat piss – some cat piss flavors can be good)”
That is classic man!!! Made my day!

Here is a vote for diacetal. Once a brewer from an East bay establishment approached me and blatantly criticized one of my favorite brewpubs in San Francisco. Too bad that I totally disagreed with him.

By: Todd

Todd — Wed, 25 Feb 2009 18:33:39 +0000

I agree with most of your entries. I can’t order my list from 1 – 10, but I’ll split it into big deal/not a big deal.

Not a big deal:
Cardboard/oxidized (when it’s bad-testing, not sherry-like, oxidation)

Catty (when it’s bad cat piss – some cat piss flavors can be good)

Big deal:
Creamed corn/Cabbage – always disgusting

Solvent – hangover beer

Hot alcohol / fusels – may fit into solvent, but I think solvent flavors can be caused by infection, whereas fusels come from mistreating the yeast.

Super sharp grapefruit flavors – not the typical Cascade flavors, but some sort of interaction between yeast and hops (I think). I had a pint of Le Freak that had that problem, and that I couldn’t finish. I also brewed a double IPA and an IPA with the same problem. I know some people love it, though.

Diacetyl – when it’s not wanted. I love Fullers ESB, though, and that’s got some diacetyl.

Unbalanced hops – Pliny the Elder is a delicious hop bomb, don’t get me wrong. But some uber-hopped beers are just painful, and seem more about the manliness of drinking such unpalatable beer, rather than the variety and beauty of the hops. I don’t think that falls under catty, since that’s a specific set of hop types.